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Old 04-15-2004, 08:48 AM   #51
Trith
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We've not seen any news from Belgium, Luxembourg, Hungary, Turkey, Sweden, Denmark or Switzerland yet. Keep that anti-european sentiment going strong.
Don't have a problem with those countries..they never cock-blocked the war on terror in the UN.

JUDICIOUS means they fight when they need to not when they want to.
That's a cute spin. It doesn't allow for the fact that there has been an instance where they needed to and didn't however.

It should also be pointed out that there are a large number of French troops in Afghanistan.
Great. There are however terrorists in many other countries at the moment. We are finally seeing now, just how large the terrorist contingency in Iraq actually was with all the insurgent activity as of late. There are no French troops in Iraq...only bids to profit on the rebuilding.
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Old 04-15-2004, 08:53 AM   #52
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NORAID was not a religious organisation and there were a lot of Irish-American political figures associated with it. It was not an underground organisation and funneled a lot of money and guns to the IRA during the height of the Troubles.

I need not say much more as Kerryn, Xantharr and Sakkath have done enough for now (I have enjoyed this thread immensly by the way, great job lads), but terrorism and fighting same is nothing new to most European countries. Especially Britain, Spain and France who have faced down and continue to do so, their own terrorst threats.
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Old 04-15-2004, 08:55 AM   #53
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http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,117200,00.html

/sigh
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Old 04-15-2004, 08:56 AM   #54
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but terrorism and fighting same is nothing new to most European countries. Especially Britain, Spain and France who have faced down and continue to do so, their own terrorst threats.
Wouldn't it be nice if we stopped facing it down..and ended it instead?
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Old 04-15-2004, 08:59 AM   #55
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Trith

"Don't have a problem with those countries..they never cock-blocked the war on terror in the UN."

Bzzzt wrong. France, Germany and Russia never cock blocked anything to do with a war on terror. In fact 1441 was all to do with a war on Iraq over the issue of WMDs. Nothing to do with terrorism. Nothing at all at all.


Also there was no actual blocking of any sort whether using cocks or other types of chickens. They did say however that if the US sought a new resolution (as they would have to do under the terms of 1441) to invade Iraq they would most likely veto it based on lack of evidence. So the US/UK didnt bother even trying for a resolution and went a la carte.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:03 AM   #56
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. They did say however that if the US sought a new resolution (as they would have to do under the terms of 1441) to invade Iraq they would most likely veto it based on lack of evidence.
Which was a cock-block. 1441 did not require an additional resolution..it provided for serious consequences. The only thing requiring additional resolutions was France..and what had us frustrated is that this was a never ending process with France. Resolutions meant nothing to Hussein, because he knew (thought) the UN lacked the spine to enforce them..which if we had followed France's lead, he would have been right.

Incase you don't know yet..the war in Iraq IS part of the war on terror. They are inseperable.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:06 AM   #57
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I officially offer Bin Laden a truce. If he stops all terrorist activities I wont skull fuck him in the left eye socket when I finally meet him. Someone please pass this on to the appropriate authorities.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:07 AM   #58
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So what you're basically saying is that Europe needs to suffer yet more deaths so you can inflate your ego? You speak of "we" like you actually believe that you personally Chuk defend the interest of civilisation.
I didnt say you should suffer deaths, i didnt even mean that you should. I said you need another major threat of invasion and destruction (ala hitler) for you to realize we have always been there for Britain and the rest of europe and are STILL there to help no matter how much you shit on us or hate us.
At least Tony Blair can recognize this and you guys will throw him out next year becuase of it.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:09 AM   #59
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Well it comes from the thinking that France handed out welcome bundles to the Nazis and it's mainly supported by people that think the French Resistance was a group of 17th century painters.

France is a pretty big country as Europe goes so when a large military force occupied Paris there was very little that the french could do. Still despite it being a massacre they fought and they lost hundreds of thousands of lives. When the time came that they had to surrender like many countries before them had they did so.

Whilst nobody likes it sometimes you must accept occupation and fight a guerilla war. It was taken as a sign of weakness, and to some extent it was. But the ignorant will always see prudence as cowardice.

World War 2 Timeline - Source 1
World War 2 Timeline - Source 2
World War 2 Timeline - Source 3

I think if you had any clue of what happened in World War 2 you would not make the comments you do, but I reckon you've obtained all you know about the war from "Where Eagles Dare", "Saving Ryan's Privates" and a few re-runs of Allo Allo.

In there you'll see that France did not give up without a fight. You'll also see America declaring neutrality for a year and a half.

Now if you're suggesting that France declaring neutrality in the Iraq war is cowardice are you also suggesting the US were cowardly from 1939 to 1941? I'll leave my opinion till we've heard yours.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:09 AM   #60
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Well...Chuk summed it up for me I suppose.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:09 AM   #61
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France and Germany and Russia. France were the only ones to come out and say they would veto any further resolutions which led to war, but the Germans and Russians backed them up on it. So lets hear some vitriol for them damn Ruskies and Krauts. Chine too while your at it, it is more than likely that they would have used their power of veto. What happened Trith did you choke on some roquefort when you were a kid?
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:12 AM   #62
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Now if you're suggesting that France declaring neutrality in the Iraq war is cowardice are you also suggesting the US were cowardly from 1939 to 1941? I'll leave my opinion till we've heard yours.
If I remember correctly the Democrats were in control of the US prior to and during the French occupation so..yes..cowardly is probably a good term to use to describe American decisions during that time period. The Dems here usually don't tend to act on military matters until they get their asses shot out from under them and have no other choice.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:15 AM   #63
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Usna those other nations were driven by the French. For a solid week we saw the French diplomat to the UN ACTIVELY visiting and pleading with other nations to block the activities of the US. I did not see Russia or China or Germany sending out diplomats to drum up support against the United States..but I did see France.

No..but roquefort does suck. American Pepperjack is teh bomb.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:18 AM   #64
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Roquefort sucks? Ok now I know you are insane and this excuses all your previous postings
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:26 AM   #65
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There's that overinflated sense of self worth rearing it's head again.

always been there for Britain and the rest of europe and are STILL there to help no matter how much you shit on us or hate us.
I don't hate Americans. I don't even hate you. I think you're ( EDIT : BIG FUCKING EDIT : "you're" does not refer to Americans. It refers to Chukzombi specifically. ) fucking pathetic but I don't hate you. I think you've got backpedaling down to a fine art but then again, you've had a lot of practice.

Im not sure how you think Chuk summed it up for you Trith since he was basically advocating an invasion of Europe and you're waffling about UN resolutions which you haven't read and posting links about stolen passports.

Last edited by Kerryn; 04-15-2004 at 09:32 AM.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:36 AM   #66
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He wasn't advocating an invasion. He was saying that it takes the threat of invasion to unify you guys on anything. I hope we don't have to wait until some group of crazed Islamic terrorists detonate a nuke in the middle of Paris or London or Madrid to get unification on the need to combat terror everywhere. No one want's to see that happen, but it seems the threat of that may be the only thing to spur people to action.

I've read 1441 more times than I needed to. The provision for military action was included. I posted the link to the French passport theft because I think it shows that France is not taking the issues of terrorism seriously enough. 10,000 passport blanks stolen is pure unexcusable negligence.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:38 AM   #67
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Thats right Kerryn keep telling yourself the US isnt as important as they really are.

Ill leave it to a great poet!

You know what I'm gonna do?
I'm gonna get myself a 1967 Cadaliac Eldarado Convertable,
Hot Pink!
With whale skin hub caps,
An all leather cow interior,
And big brown baby seal eyes for headlights.
YEAH!
And I'm gonna drive around in that baby,
At 115 miles per hour,
Getting one mile per gallon,
Sucking down quarter pounder cheeseburgers from McDonalds in the old-fasioned non-biodegradable styrafoam containers.
And when I'm done sucking down those grease ball burgers,
I'm gonna wipe my mouth in the American flag,
And then I'm gonna toss the styrafoam containers right out the side,
And there ain't a God damn thing anybody can do about it,
You know why?
'Cause we got the bombs, that's why.
Two words, Nuclear Fucking Weapons OK.
Russia, Germany, Romania,
They can have all the democracy they want.
They can have a big democracy cake,
Walk right through the middle of Tienemen Square,
And it won't make a lick of difference,
Because we got the bombs OK!
John Wayne's not dead,
He's frozen.
And as soon as we find a cure for cancer, we're gonna thaw out the duke.
And he's gonna be pretty pissed off,
You know why?
Have you ever taken a cold shower?
Well multiply that by 15 million times,
That's how pissed off the duke's gonna be.
I'm gonna get the duke,
im joking, but dont tell Kerryn
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:43 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by Trech
I officially offer Bin Laden a truce. If he stops all terrorist activities I wont skull fuck him in the left eye socket when I finally meet him. Someone please pass this on to the appropriate authorities.
Take a number Trech...the line starts, here.

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Old 04-15-2004, 09:49 AM   #69
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No. Losing 10,000 passports is a fuck up.

Not tightening your own security knowing that information and then blaming it on the French would be an act of unexcusable negligence.

As to the part about another Hitler. You must think I'm stupid if you think I'm going to believe he meant we need to see the threat. The fact of that is that for us to see the importance of America we would not only have to have a threat but the actual invasion. Thats where his post turns to the advocacy of war on Europe.

Now one of you, post one bit where I said America isn't important or shut the fuck up.

Oh and one last thing before I leave for the evening...

Chuk,

you're an A, S S, H O, L E
you're an A, S S, H O, L E
you're an A, S S, H O, L E

And I'm not colourblind dickhead.
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:57 AM   #70
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They did say however that if the US sought a new resolution (as they would have to do under the terms of 1441) to invade Iraq they would most likely veto it based on lack of evidence.
So since 1441 REQUIRED evidence- and there was NO EVIDENCE, you are saying France was wrong for following it?
It appears to me that since there was no further evidence, that WE DIDN'T FOLLOW IT. That would make this war illegal since we drafted and signed the resolution. All France did was follow the law.
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Old 04-15-2004, 10:00 AM   #71
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1441 required COMPLIANCE with other UN resoltions too numerous to list. Iraq was in violation of many previous resolutions, and all 1441 called for was full compliance. Iraq did not comply, nor did they ever intend to.
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Old 04-15-2004, 10:03 AM   #72
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Kerryn, while you and I don't see eye to eye on very much I applaud your stance in your original post. You understand that "all that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing."

I am glad that England has in the past and most likley will be in the future a good friend to the United States of America. I am glad that Germany is in Afganistan with us, I applaud Italy for it's steadfastness although I will admit sharing a measure of antipathy for France I do not wish it's populace any harm (although if thier current leadership fell into a pit full of pissed off wolverines on Angel Dust I would not shed a tear) as for Russia, Cold War prejudices die hard and I frankly do not trust them as far as I could throw them.
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Old 04-15-2004, 10:05 AM   #73
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Iraq was in violation of many previous resolutions, and all 1441 called for was full compliance. Iraq did not comply, nor did they ever intend to.
1441 called for a UN Security Council vote before ANY ACTION was taken. It doesn't matter at the point whether Iraq followed 1441 or not. 1441 was not a resolution towards war.
The next step according to 1441 would have been a resolution voted upon for a further resolution. That further resolution would have spelled out the course of action. We did not follow 1441 because fuckup wanted to play GI Joe. We broke the resolution, hence most of the world hates us now. And since FRANCE was still following it, how the hell can you blame them for following the resolution that WE DRAFTED? Perhaps its this WAFFLING on UN Resolutions by the Bush administration that caused the problem.

Its funny Bush speaks of staying the course since he definitely didn't stay the course of 1441.
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Old 04-15-2004, 10:09 AM   #74
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Again, 1441 already contained provisions for force Bumble. No additional resolutions were necessary at all, even though France tried to make the case that they were. The attempt to pass an additional resolution was done only for the sake of show, and to give France one last chance to hop on board before the train pulled out, which they of course rejected.

1441 did not ever require an additional resolution to be voted on.
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Old 04-15-2004, 10:18 AM   #75
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Again, 1441 already contained provisions for force Bumble
They did?
Show us where big boy.
And when you can't show us where- Will you then admit you were wrong?
And I wanna see where it says MILITARY FORCE!!!!
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