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Old 09-15-2003, 10:14 PM   #1
Tpearla
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Default To pharm, or not to pharm? That is the question.

Hiya all!
Although this isn't totally meant to be a R&F, I know it'll end up getting here because pharming, camping, KSing, and the like are all hot topics. Earlier today, some of my guild and I decide to go kill Lodi like usual. Well, since we just killed him the last couple times, some of us were camped there and when we entered EQ, we were there. I logged in, and there are 3 other people in Iceclad. A 35 Beastlord from Affliction (really cool guy), and 2 people from AotET. Those 2 people consisted of a 40ish bard and a 63 or 64 warrior. Well the other 3 members of my guild show up and we prep up to do Lodi.. Nobody else is even close to Lodi spawn spot, so we figure it's all good and that it's gonna be another uneventful Lodi kill. Then in /ooc the bard decides to say that Lodi is camped... along with Stormy.. I check /who again and the same people are in the zone. Plus, our druid checks tracking and the bard isn't even close to where we are. Well then the warrior and bard say that they've been camping Lodi for 10 hours, which I thought was funny since I logged in 3 hours previously and the zone was completely EMPTY. Anyway, there's a small debate in /ooc about the First in Force rule. After that, Lodi pops and I click him with my agro stick.. Our druid snares him, DoTs him a bit, and then the bard and warrior run up to KS us. Thinking it kinda funny, we sit back and let Lodi kill the warrior and watch the bard run off. Then, we resume the killing of Lodi. Lodi drops about 20 seconds after the rest of AotET show up. Obviously, we were First in Force, had the manpower to kill Lodi, and was actually at the spot Lodi spawns when he spawned... Then we start getting harrassed. I'm going to leave most of the convo out because it was basically the same ol' "you KSd us! blah blah blah" We'll, I actually sit down and explain the situation to the members of AotET that weren't there but showed up during the Lodi kill.. Took about 40 minutes and all I got were a bunch of people saying a bunch of different things..including respecting camps. I respect camps, but if a lvl 35 ranger is in NToV on your guild's raid day, and says he's "camping" it, does your guild leave? <--- just an example The warrior (Battlekatt) even got mad enough to say that if he knew where I lived in RL, he's murder me. I have screenshots of the entire fight, and everything that was said in convo from that point on. I'm not going to bother putting them up, because it's off the subject...

BASICALLY, I just want to know if people on this server follow the First in Force rule. Although Sony doesn't acknowledge camps, FiF, KSing, or anything of that nature, it'd be good to know what the majority of Emarr thinks and respects.

Well, tried to keep this short, but oh well
/emote watches and waits for the flaming of her to begin
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Old 09-15-2003, 10:17 PM   #2
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I just think its pathetic that someone has to threaten real violence over a game. Isnt there enough violence in the world today as it is?
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Old 09-15-2003, 10:21 PM   #3
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Sorry if they didn't have a force in the zone that could kill Lodi they weren't camping him.
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Old 09-15-2003, 10:22 PM   #4
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shoulda reported it, EQ takes RL threats very seriously. Beyond that people will always bitch some are founded and some are complete BS. If you know its BS ignore it, if it gets to be too much again the petition/ignore/report features are all there.
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Old 09-15-2003, 10:24 PM   #5
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Oh, I did /report his "murder" comment
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Old 09-15-2003, 10:28 PM   #6
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isnt battlecatt the warrior who months ago ninja'd a wingblade in sky and jumped off the island? thought i remember reading that..... now ksing lodi? and threating to murder someone, sounds like a real winner!
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Old 09-15-2003, 11:42 PM   #7
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Yup, Battlecat was the ninja-looter in the Plane of Sky. I admit I am surprised to see such a winner like Battlecat on the E-Marr considering all the stupid shit he has done, and is still currently doing. Hell, last I saw him, he even has a guild now...not that I am going to drag them into this.
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Old 09-16-2003, 04:13 AM   #8
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First in force rule sucks. Why? Who determines whether or not you have the force? Several times when I still played I was faced with a situation where my guild was at a target first only to have another guild decide we didnt have enough to do the target while the whole time I knew it was doable.
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Old 09-16-2003, 04:43 AM   #9
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Dang, at first I thought Battlecat was "I got your idiot hanging"...but searching back that was Steelcat.

Ah well. Nice to see some people are still lame enough to try a "real life" threat over pixels. A nice /report and /petition should make his day.
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Old 09-16-2003, 05:11 AM   #10
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Actually, GMs have held up the FiF rule on Lodi many times in the past. It is funny that the bard and warrior even attempted him. You were gracious to give them a shot. They tried and failed. You were there first with the force to kill him. Your kill, clean and by the rules.

Oh, by the way, kiting Lodi around until you get a force there does not count as engagement with respect to the FiF rule. If you are kiting him around and not killing him, a force can step in and kill him. You can't tie him up like that and expect to keep him. Moral: Don't engage him unless you think you can kill him. It will save you aggravation.

AotET seems to have recruited a special group of people.
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Old 09-16-2003, 05:51 AM   #11
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The fact that Battlecatt was involved does not suprise me at all. What does suprise me is that a guild actually accepted him as a member.
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Old 09-16-2003, 06:13 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Tpearla
After that, Lodi pops and I click him with my agro stick.. Our druid snares him, DoTs him a bit, and then the bard and warrior run up to KS us. Thinking it kinda funny, we sit back and let Lodi kill the warrior and watch the bard run off.
LOL, you evil, EVIL bastage!
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Old 09-16-2003, 06:15 AM   #13
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Hail,
AotET seems to have recruited a special group of people
They use the /shout recruiting method in PoK and Nexus. /boggle

A warrior/bard duo of those levels would not in my opinion constitue a kill force, unless the Warrior had a few bags of Stinging Wort potions...

As you described it, your group had first aggro (though they 'called' the camp), the AotET duo engaged after your party, had their tank drop and the bard running for his life, at which point you re-engaged and killed Lodi. Right before Lodi died the rest of AotET kill force showed up and the chat nastiness began...

Aside from Battlecat's horrible reputation, I don't think AotET had a valid claim from the way you have described the events.
, I just want to know if people on this server follow the First in Force rule.
It depends on who you ask. MANY guilds will respect called camps. As the content you are camping gets more competitive, the amount of respect your camp will receive is in large degree based on whether or not you have a viable kill force in the zone. Some spawns that are triggered by killing specific mobs (like in Ssra for example) are generally given to the guild that slew the mobs required as a prerequisite for the boss mob to spawn regardless of the kill force present in the zone.

If you kill Aary in NToV, North is generally defaulted to that guild for 24hrs as long as they don't leave North to go raid elsewhere. If you kill the Rhags or Taskmasters in Ssra, the AL/Cursed cycle is usually defaulted to your guild for the night, though that isn't always the case.

A few guilds will run over others in order to achieve their goals, but I would say the majority will almost always respect your called camp if you have a kill-force in zone. Exceptions to this usually end up with heated flame threads in this forum...

Good luck,
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Old 09-16-2003, 07:16 AM   #14
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My very first day logging into EQ...I remember sitting in Gfay and listening to a couple of guild recruiting shouts going on. I had no idea what a guild even was...and a higher level Ranger who stopped by to say hello to me gave me some very wise information. If a guild has to recruit by shouting out in zone...they are most likely a guild you do not wish to be in. I remember that comment to this day...and how true it is.
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Old 09-16-2003, 08:28 AM   #15
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Hello, Yakun here. I should start, I guess by saying that I am the Guild Leader of Avatars of the Emerald Throne. That being said, I already expect to be flamed but, I don't care.

First: I'll say it myself, Battlecatt was way out of line in his threats in and vocabulary in post-incodent chat and he knows this. I appologize for that. He also should not have engaged Lodi if you did have first agro (I wasn't there yet, can't comment on that, will take your word for it).

Second: No, Sony does not recognize/support the First in Force "rule", nor do they recognize camps but, most people/guilds do respect camps. They do, however, condemn KSing. My point through the whole discussion was that Battlecatt had been camping the spawn for over ten hours. I know that he truely was there the whole time cause I was on most of the day and I use the guild management toll quite a bit. We were on call to come help him with the killing of Lodi and came as soon as we got the word. Sadly we arrived too late to prevent this incedent.

Lastly: Yes, we occasionally recruit via /shout... so what? Most of our new members are players that have grouped/raided with us and enjoyed themselves or have friends in AotET that have come over to try the guild out. Also, 90% or so of our new members stay with us and are happy. No, we are not now, nor will we ever be a guild that requires you to jump through hoops to gain membership. All are welcome and we judge you based on your actions while in the guild, not on what someone that we don't even know says on a message board. We don't like the "uber guild" mentality and want to give everyone a chance to show their usefullness.

Anyway, I hope we can all get along in the furture and all have some in this pseudo-life we call EverQuest.

Enjoy
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Old 09-16-2003, 08:40 AM   #16
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Originally posted by Yakun

Second: No, Sony does not recognize/support the First in Force "rule"
I thought the whole First in Force thing was started by GMs...
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Old 09-16-2003, 08:42 AM   #17
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Second: No, Sony does not recognize/support the First in Force "rule", nor do they recognize camps but, most people/guilds do respect camps. They do, however, condemn KSing. My point through the whole discussion was that Battlecatt had been camping the spawn for over ten hours. I know that he truely was there the whole time cause I was on most of the day and I use the guild management toll quite a bit. We were on call to come help him with the killing of Lodi and came as soon as we got the word. Sadly we arrived too late to prevent this incedent.
Then maybe a small bit of research on your part will help you. Do a search on these Emarr boards for "Lodi"(warning, you'll probably get a lot of hits due to all the whining on this MOB). Do some reading of them. You'll find that the general agreement is that Lodi is not a camp and is a first in force mob.
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Old 09-16-2003, 09:37 AM   #18
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Earlier today, some of my guild and I decide to go kill Lodi like usual. Well, since we just killed him the last couple times, some of us were camped there and when we entered EQ, we were there.

no sympathy for farmers.


If you wouldnt farm a mob everytime its up, you wouldnt have even had to make the post...there would have been no confrontation, all would be ok.

Gotta love the greediness this game (ESPECIALLY THAT DAMN TURTLE) brings out in people.
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Old 09-16-2003, 09:48 AM   #19
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Only thing I see wrong with this situation is how can Battlecat be camping 2 Mobs in the same zone, I am not sure what time this happened, but when I was in tells with him about SS Guants I am looking to Chain, his AFK said he was Camping Stormfeather (Which was about 6:30-7:30 PM EST), and it seems they even called camping both

What gives someone the right to camp both mobs pick one, you cant camp the whole zone and I also dont consider it camping him if you are not at his spawn point. If you are on the other side of where he spawns watching for Storm then you are not camping Lodi, if you are at Lodi's spot you are not camping Storm.

That is like zoning into BoT and saying I am camping All Lower Camps, it wouldnt fly there and shouldnt fly anywhere else.

I dont have anything against AotET and have nothing against them recruiting in OOC, if they want to do that it is their right as a Guild, My personal belief is just that by doing that you open your guild up to the Chance of recieving some very bad members / publicity.
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Old 09-16-2003, 09:53 AM   #20
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Ok, this has just confirmed that AotET is a special guild with special rules. I am so glad they are there to provide a home for people like Battlecatt who would otherwise be homeless.

I feel all warm and fuzzy now.
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Old 09-16-2003, 10:52 AM   #21
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Go by what Battlecat did while in your guild is he still a member?
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Old 09-16-2003, 11:32 AM   #22
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Gravdiger, you missed a point in some of the earlier posts. Lodi is not a camp mob. Lodi is a First in Force mob. Camp it all you like with one person. If I show up with six and you have one, I will be right in taking him out regardless of how long you sat there. There is significant precedent for this mob. The fact that they called Lodi as a camp is completely irrelevant and a waste of keystrokes.

As a general rule, if people have a problem with FiF mobs, they might as well forget Tier 3+ PoP raiding. They will be sorely abused.
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Old 09-16-2003, 11:41 AM   #23
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Oh I totally understand that, just saying in a General Idea, you really cant / shouldnt try and camp 2 Mobs in Zone at same time, even if they are camps

Pick the Named you want and do it.
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Old 09-16-2003, 11:42 AM   #24
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heh, people are jumpy about the Lodi "camp".

I had once camped out at the gnoll village and just sat there when I logged back in talking to people. A warrior and some other class were there and the warrior sends me a garbled tell saying that Lodi is camped. I tell him, cool, I'm not even after Lodi, just talking a few to friends before I move out.

This whole time there, he is sending me tells about it being camped, sounding like some little kid, so to just irk him, I just sit there and have more conversations, decide to make myself dinner and such =P
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Old 09-16-2003, 11:47 AM   #25
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Default Lodi = Special ?

Guess then he's not a soloable mob by those rules then? What you're saying with this statement
If I show up with six and you have one, I will be right in taking him out regardless of how long you sat there.
For exampile if I'm sitting there with Coruduth all buffed up and hasted et all you're gonna gank him just cause you can? I'm there FiF and able to take the mob out period, doesn't mean KS'ing is any better in this instance. (And yes, I have had him ganked on me twice because I was solo)
I've wanted to try Lodi solo for quite some time now, just to say I can and have done it, not for lootz or anything of the sort, not that I'll turn the loot down but hey, the accomplishment is the key for me.

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