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Old 05-16-2008, 10:42 AM   #26
Drysdale
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Originally Posted by Hormadrune View Post
Wow, a parallel between the plight of homosexuals and the Patriots...really?

And honestly, a single 40+ bartender with a history of legal troubles talking about the BS lives of others?

Awesome stuff as always.
Well...

thge Patriots ARE a bunch of fags...

/flees
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Old 05-16-2008, 11:06 AM   #27
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How was one and done (again) this year?
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Old 05-16-2008, 11:07 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Brigiid
"What the State is deciding is what they (the State) will recognize as a legally binding marriage."
Before the amendment a 'gay' marriage was somewhat a contentious legal issue anyway. What exactly did removing the amendment change, really?

The Law Courts don't wed people. Come to think of it Civil ceremonies are not strictly 'Weddings' as I understand it, tho they do result in a marriage license. It seems to me that the Court has failed to consider that all the various Churches, and Mosques, and Temples, and them Synagogue joints have a legal claim to the 'Property Rights' for conducting their respective Wedding ceremonies. Much as a Trademark/CopyRight/Intellectual Property/Native Title claim goes. After all, you have to pay them for that too.

In the end, the Court decision will get canned, it lacks an adequate Canvass of all entitled claimants and stuff. It risks appearing to promote a view that only for some people is there an benefit of Law. Gays are still entitled to a hetero marriage, its just the fact they are s'posed to be up front and honest about their vows. Otherwise the marriage would be annulled. Adjudication of a 'Gay' right to union as it stands now means jack diddly (well, my money would be on another Court judgment to come yet) since the State doesn't really do Weddings, that isn't its gig. It, the State, issues Marriage licenses, and Registers marriages. That's it. The precedence of a thousand higher Courts through history will hand holy wedlock to the religious faiths.

I'm sorry for the gays. It's not personal I just do not share their point of view. There's no kindness to reveal in there, it's my opinion as cold as stone or scathing as Water on hot coals. There can be no Wedding in Church (unless it's on a stage set) for the most part, if the Churches really wanted they could get a class action for the constitutional/statutory Property Rights to perform 'legal' Weddings. I'm sure they could. How many people marry who have never been to California anyway; see how much difference that Court makes to an institution?

Gays have to learn the hard way: (a)You can't always get what you want. (b)A Square peg will not fit into a Round hole (c) You can't have your Cake and eat it simultaneously, etc.
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Old 05-16-2008, 11:12 AM   #29
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Misty, you're assuming all churches are against gay marriage. That's simply not true. Gay friendly churches are certainly very few and far between, but they exist.
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Old 05-16-2008, 11:22 AM   #30
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If everyone was gay, the procreation of the species would be in jeopardy.
In theory, but not in practicality. There are plenty of gays who have procreated. Not all sex is done for pleasure, sometimes (I hate to say it) its purely functional.
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Old 05-16-2008, 11:48 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Misty
The Law Courts don't wed people
Legally, they do. The JoP does.

Originally Posted by Misty
It seems to me that the Court has failed to consider that all the various Churches, and Mosques, and Temples, and them Synagogue joints have a legal claim to the 'Property Rights' for conducting their respective Wedding ceremonies.
Firstly, no they don't. The right to freedom of religion puts "religion" in the realm of public domain. Anyone is free to worship as they please (without royalties due - unless you Catholics I suppose ><)

Additionally, the ceremonies are not what is included in this legislation. The legislation defines the definition for the state government, it does not define it for religious institutions, as that would be prohibited by the Federal Constitution.

Originally Posted by Misty
In the end, the Court decision will get canned, it lacks an adequate Canvass of all entitled claimants and stuff
No, actually it won't.

The decision was to block an amendment/legislation that would materially change current legislation. The decision itself did not include the pre-existing notion of legal definitions of marriage.

What happened is the decision canned a seperate movement... therefor the decision could not get "canned" for the reason you stated. I don't know if it can be appealed or not.
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Old 05-16-2008, 11:49 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by Hormadrune
"Misty, you're assuming all churches are against gay marriage. That's simply not true. Gay friendly churches are certainly very few and far between, but they exist."
I've heard the rumor of them in the Wind. They are just 'trendy' little congregations. Everyone knows a hard liner wins in a long haul. All the really extreme fundamentalist religions and their wackjob acolytes are <cough> 'vocal'.

This whole frikkin subject is pot-holed with complication and cobwebbed assumptions. It's monstrously hard to write anything worth a cuss through the minefield. But most of the complication is historical rather than anything new the Court has to say about marriage today.
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Old 05-16-2008, 12:21 PM   #33
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Actually, the Methodist Church passed some pretty Gay-friendly resolutions this year at their national Conference.
Delegates voted 501-417 to adopt the minority report which also includes wording that "all persons are individuals of sacred worth, created in the image of God," and that United Methodists are to be "welcoming, forgiving and loving one another, as Christ has loved and accepted us."

They also approved a new resolution opposing homophobia and heterosexism. In a separate resolution, the General Conference asked the United Methodist Board of Church and Society, the church's social advocacy agency, to develop educational resources and materials on the effects of homophobia and heterosexism, the discrimination or prejudice against lesbians or gay men by heterosexual people.
Not the huge step forward gay activists wanted, but still a pretty decent step.
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Old 05-16-2008, 12:24 PM   #34
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Ok. .i will be the dummy here. What is heterosexism?
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Old 05-16-2008, 01:23 PM   #35
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I'm thinking it's "the discrimination or prejudice against lesbians or gay men by heterosexual people" that they refer to. Never heard that word before, but I suppose it was only a matter of time till a word got created for it.
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Old 05-16-2008, 01:25 PM   #36
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosexism

I had to look it up too...
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Old 05-16-2008, 01:29 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Misty
The Law Courts don't wed people.
They do, actually. In some cases.

More importantly, though, they recognize marriages performed to their standards as legally binding. Like I said, you can have your gay wedding in a church that approves of homosexuality, and you can call yourself husband and husband until the day you die. But if the State doesn't choose to recognize your union as valid, you don't enjoy the legal benefits and protections of marriage.
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Old 05-16-2008, 01:40 PM   #38
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That word is pretty gay. I guess by saying that, I become it. Sad.
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Old 05-16-2008, 01:41 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by ShardmoonVer.1 View Post
That word is pretty gay. I guess by saying that, I become it. Sad.
It's ok honey...

/cuddle
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Old 05-16-2008, 01:46 PM   #40
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Well, two more passengers for the Gayhound bus to California!
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Old 05-16-2008, 01:50 PM   #41
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I better pick up a dictionary on the way so I am current on all the new words.

Homonymph, Synofelch, Teabageritis.

Its a brave new world... and its looks FABULOUS!!!
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Old 05-16-2008, 02:29 PM   #42
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Yeah... when considering the "sanctity" of LEGAL marriage, remember simply representing yourself as married to someone on your tax form will pa-ching! make you married! It's THAT easy!
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Old 05-16-2008, 02:32 PM   #43
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And that always holds up on audits.
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Old 05-16-2008, 05:01 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by Brigiid View Post
They do, actually. In some cases.

More importantly, though, they recognize marriages performed to their standards as legally binding. Like I said, you can have your gay wedding in a church that approves of homosexuality, and you can call yourself husband and husband until the day you die. But if the State doesn't choose to recognize your union as valid, you don't enjoy the legal benefits and protections of marriage.
You can shoot baskets in to a folgers can nailed to your garage and call yourself Michael Jordon to...just makes you a flaming idiot. (unless your really Michael Jordon I guess).
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Old 05-16-2008, 10:14 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Wildane View Post
Well, two more passengers for the Gayhound bus to California!
Hush up and get back in the driver's seat!
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Old 05-17-2008, 12:39 AM   #46
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they declared that the law regarding marriages in the state to be unconstitutional .


ok lets make that retro active. and null and void all marriages in the state. oh wait that would include the divorces too since can't have divorced someone you didn't marry.

Oh wait thats that alimony and dividing of property.. parental control of kids.. the list goes on and on.

I suspect that they have opened a really huge ass can of worms.
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Old 05-17-2008, 04:23 AM   #47
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they declared that the law regarding marriages in the state to be unconstitutional .
You left out the word "Ban", as in "Ban on marriages to be unconstitutional". Kinda has a different meaning when you leave words out.
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Old 05-17-2008, 06:04 AM   #48
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Yeah, but if he doesn't selectively quote things his argument falls apart, and that's no fun if you're trying to pretend that by allowing gay people to marry, society falls apart.
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Old 05-17-2008, 06:58 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by Hormadrune View Post
Misty, you're assuming all churches are against gay marriage. That's simply not true. Gay friendly churches are certainly very few and far between, but they exist.
They may call themselves Christian Churches but they are not worshipping the God of the bible, its a self endulged feel good bullshit church thinking they are tricking God into thinking they are true beleivers, point blank God made up the rules not them and their rules will be paid for in the end.
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Old 05-17-2008, 08:42 AM   #50
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So, you know for a fact that God (still) doesn't approve of homosexuality, or that he has a problem with them getting married to each other?
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